The Audacity of Authenticity with Joshua Smith

Let's go deeper. Let's go beyond the fabrics, the wallcovering, and even the paycheck.

On this episode of The Designer Within Podcast, Joshua Smith and I have a heartfelt conversation around so many of the events that occur in our lives: business and personal. Joshua has such an open spirit and heart and he's sharing his thoughts on how he handled the ups and downs that many of us also endure.

In this episode, Joshua and I discuss:
* His personal journey into interior design and how his non-traditional path has led to his success
* The "aha moments" that Josh had in 2023 around pricing his services, choosing his clients, and marketing his business
* How Josh and I relate to the illusion of "too busy" or "too successful" that the general public sometimes have
* The way that Josh starts his day and how it sets him off on the right foot for anything that happens during the day

Sit back, settle in, and enjoy this in-depth conversation with the always interesting and enlightening Joshua Smith.

To find more on Joshua Smith Inc:
Website: https://www.joshuasmithinc.com/
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/joshuasmithinc/?hl=en

What if you could finally create the interior design business of your dreams while consistently making 6 figures and doing it all with no stress? Join Design Business Fast Track today to make your Design Business dreams a reality!

www.designbusinessfasttrack.com

For all things John: www.johnmcclain.co
For more information on my online Courses & Coaching Program for Interior Designers, visit: https://designsuccessacademy.com/
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Transcript

And I think that's what it is to be an entrepreneur and to have a business is resiliency, being resilient and having fortitude, but not listening to that part of us, that inner critic that can say, you're not capable of this, you can't do this. You're not like, you're not as good as they are because we all have those kind of the war within this, what I call it, it's like, which wolf are you feeding?
Right. That's so important. Hey y'all, you're listening to the designer within podcast, episode number 34. I'm John McClain and welcome to the designer within podcast, the business minded podcast created for creative entrepreneurs by a creative entrepreneur. That's me. I know firsthand the challenges, but also the victories that can come with our careers.
And I'm here to sip and spill the tea with you. It's time to dive deep within yourself and redesign your own business and your life from the inside out together. We will uncover secrets and share valuable insights. So prepare for a transformative experience, my friends, because it's time to unleash the designer within Josh.
Welcome to the designer within podcast. Well, thank you for having me. I've been looking forward to our conversation for sure. I am so happy to have you here. We instantly connected. I think we met at High Point Market. I don't know, several years ago at a dinner or something. And you and I have a lot in common.
And even after just a pre conversation today on, before we hit the record button, I think I find out that we have even more in common. And a lot of that has to do with what you've learned over the past year, over 2023, which we're now we're recording this depending upon when someone's listening in 2024, but you've learned a lot over the past year, as have I, and I'm so interested to hear about your journey, what you've learned.
You have such an interesting story even before that, but before we get into all of that, just tell everybody. You know who you are. I love a good designers entry into the entry story into the design field. And yours is, is very interesting as well. So tell everybody about Joshua Smith design. Tell everybody about that.
Oh my gosh. Okay. Hi everybody. Joshua Smith. Everybody calls me Josh, but okay. So I. I think it was like a, uh, I knew about vision boards before vision boards were a thing. Even when I was a kid, I was obsessed with the Sunday newspapers when the houses that were for sale would come out in the paper. And some people know what a paper is because there's younger generations now, because I'm definitely of that age where that's happening.
But the Sunday paper would come out with the real estate section and I would cut out my favorite houses and put them on a bulletin board in my room and did that for years. So I was vision boarding and didn't even know it. But then growing up in a small little country town in Texas, Southern Baptists.
Coming of age stuff, but it was like, not a good place to, to be me. And so there was a lot of, a lot of trauma there that I didn't realize was trauma at the time because I just kept it in and didn't say anything and did the best little boy in the world and won everything and did everything and wanted to be exceptional in everything I did.
And also really struggled with, with faith and not understanding what I was being told. And this was before there was the internet. So you couldn't find out any answers on your own. Your internet was the encyclopedia, which. Also, some listening will not know what that is, but it was 18 books and everything in the world of information was there.
It wasn't. And so you really just had to go with what you heard. So I really started from a very early age and we all have our own versions of this is what I learned is that this feeling of like, I'm not worthy. I've been getting all these messages is I'm not lovable and I'm unworthy. And frankly, God doesn't love me.
And I just couldn't understand and put all that together for myself. And then again, having no one to speak that to, afraid of what people might say, just this real inner conflict and kind of creating my own what ended up being kind of like depression by the time I was 18 years old. So that actually.
Ended up sending me into a kind of a spiral where I went, I call it a detour into darkness. That's a whole nother podcast. Never wanna come out later, later on. But yeah, so at one point, by 21, 22, I was homeless. Didn't even have a home. Everybody was done with me and I was done with them mainly. That's what started it.
And then, yeah, it was just, it's a, it's amazing what will happen when there is no self-love. Sense of worthiness where it'll take you and fast forward a few years later, 'cause like I said, that's all another, the podcast, I realized at this moment of clarity, I was like, wait, what? What's, what are you? What are you doing?
It's like, and by then the internet had come out and I was getting more information and I was learning things and it was like, wait, wait. These are all, this is all just, these were just one perspective. But it was kinda this like waking up, if you will. It was like it wasn't awakening and it was really like, you know what?
I am capable of so much more than this and I am no longer going to sit here. And self pity and feeling victimized, even though that may be true. And I can do something about it. And I have more power than I think I do. And so that's when I decided to like, uh, that's it. And I pulled myself together. I decided I was going to get into real estate.
And so I did get real estate license, started selling real estate. And I remember starting off this funny story, this story about Jerome, because I can. But I went across the street, I was working at a bank and went across the street to this real estate office. And I'm like, I want to sell real estate. I was 24 at this time.
And he's like, okay, well, do you have a real estate license? I'm like, no, but I want to get one. Where do I, where do I get a real estate license? When you're young, you're just like so courageous. And I was so naive. Where can I buy that? I'm like, where do I get my license? I mean, did you just hand it out or like what I got to do?
So the fishing license, is that what that is? You just signed a form or like, what do I do? Any end? So she. She said she called this, she was nice enough to call the sales manager. She came up there and she's like, come on back. And so I went back there and she was very sweet, very gracious. She'll always be kind of these earth angels that we have on our path that you're like, if it hadn't been for you giving me a chance, I don't know where, how things might have turned out, but she was very sweet.
And she's like, so. You don't have a license now. Well, you're going to have to get a real estate license. And do you know that like, if you're a real estate agent, it's like being an independent contractor and having your own business. We kind of sponsor you, but it's a hundred percent commission. So we usually tell people you need to have six months of income.
Or monthly expenses saved up and to invest in business cards and all the things you'll need as a, as a real estate agent. Do you have that? And I'm like, no. And she's like, well, what do you think he'll do? And I was like, well, I guess I'll just have to sell a house my first day. And so of course she laughed and I'm as serious as I could be.
That was sound like the only option. So she said, let me tell you what, why don't, here's what you would need to do to get your real estate license. If you go get your real estate license, you come back and see me and we'll talk about. Now, I didn't know it was one of the bigger, well respected real estate agent companies and shoot for the stars, Josh, they were across the street.
I mean, this is one of those things where it's like, there is some co creation happening here and these other forces at will, I think I don't can't explain them and I stopped trying to figure it out, but it seems like there's no such thing as coincidences, but so very quickly. And so I did on. We can classes.
I did some night classes and some online classes. And three weeks later, I came back. I'm like, okay, I have a real estate license. And she was like, and I was like, kind of morning news and I've already given my notice of work two weeks. So are we doing this? Or she's like, well, okay, let's, let's give this a go.
And so, uh, a few days later I was like, okay, I'm going to show houses today. And she's like, you already have a client. I'm like, yeah, I think so. She's like, well, did you write it? I'm like, yeah, the form that got that signed. So I took him out and sure enough, he wanted to write a contract. So I can begin. I'm like.
And you run a contract and she's like, so you really sold a house your first day. I'm like, I hope so. Let's see if we can get this done. And I did. I did. And so that became like this great start to an eight year career selling real estate in Houston. Had you done sales before, or were you just loving the passion for homes?
Like, I mean, because as she told you, real estate is a business. Design is a business. So what you were doing was a business, which I, which is what I talk about in this podcast all the time. And so you were doing a business, but you had never sold before. Selling wasn't something where you're like, like at the gap, even growing up or whatever.
Nothing like that. I, well, I mean, the extent of my work during those twenties was. Clearly not much. I mean, maybe two years, three months. There was like kind of a growing lasting rate for me before I just kind of be like, I don't do it anymore. But no, no, I mean, no, no. And I did not finish school. Yeah. So no, no, I just, what I love is people and I love houses.
And so I think it's not hard to sell. If you love something right now, something I don't believe in, I'm like, I don't believe in that, but if I believe in a home and I believe in a potential of a home or I believe in helping people live better life, even then it was kind of all about, like, I was fortunate enough to grow up in a home where my mother loved being a mother.
It was like the, the inspirational notes on our napkins every day in our lunchbox. Just all the things in the holidays. It's this other thing too, but it's also very just she loved it. My dad was involved in everything. So I had this amazing experience of what family and home feels like and can feel like regardless of what kind of price point you're in, like.
I believe in democratizing beauty. It's just like you, you find your own version. And, and my job is to help you even find that or inspire you to do that. And that's actually what kind of started to happen is as I sold real estate, I was learning a lot by what people were saying and responding to and what they liked, what they didn't like, what challenges were.
And then after doing it enough, it was like, well, you could do this and you could do this and you'd probably open this wall here. Cause this is one of those. And it just kind of became that, which I wasn't even knowing what's happening. And I never had had a thought about being an interior designer yet, but I bought my first home.
And it was a weekend home in Brenham, Texas, a little country house. And I pulled up and land was so beautiful. It was on 13 acres. I went inside the house. I'm like, Oh my God, this needs to be torn down. But the land was so special. And of course I was still, this was 27. So I didn't have a ton of money. So I'm like, well, I'm just going to figure this out because I have to have this piece of property.
It's like speaking to me. And so I did, but I didn't do nothing. I knew nothing about design. And so I just started buying lots of magazines and books and then instantly was just like mesmerized and captivated at this whole other world and a whole other way of living and these things that you could do or me to figure out that really, as I, as I did this and pull this together and created a home for me, the power.
That that has when you're reflected in this space that you dwell. It's like, that's when I really got to say, Oh, this is more than a shelter and a dwelling place. Like this is, and feels like a sanctuary. And I started even calling it back then where it's like, this is where I can come home to. And I walk in that door and it's like, it's so good to be here.
And it's like the rest of the world just slips away. And I'm inspired by. Artwork that I might have, or this might mean something because there's a story behind it to me. And it's like all of those vibes subconsciously. And I think even back then before neuroscience was out, we like, we knew stuff about that.
It's just based on what we felt or walking into a beautiful space. Like, Oh, this is beautiful. Or like, Oh, this is beautiful, but it feels so like, I'm afraid to touch anything. Like there was all these kinds of things we were getting from our. Our chemicals being released in our brain that we just didn't have the language for it then.
But my heart started to sing. I was just obsessed. Couldn't get enough. Every time the shelter publications would come out, I just would like pour over the pages and just be so wowed and enamored. And it's like, I never had felt such passion for something before. And so I was like, I think So back in the days when you would go to like the bookstore and stand in the, in the magazine section.
Right. I did that all the time. All the time. Oh my gosh. Um, just for hours, it's like, just which book am I going to get? And then it was just like, Buildings and stacks of books and magazines, but I just could not get enough. And I was learning so much, even just about also not just designing, but lifestyle, like how to even make every, most days are ordinary, right?
They just, they just can't be, but they don't have to be. If we choose to just, how can I make this 10 percent more meaningful? I always say like, how do we make the mundane more meaningful? Right. It's like more than just a. Move that bus experience for me with my clients, which I've always looked at design shows, it's like, but what about after they move in?
How do they like, are you teaching them how to live more beautifully every day and just even a little bit, because that can impact. The rest of you're life. And so I was a big meditator and it kind of got started my spiritual path at this point, obviously. And then sitting in the stillness, I kept hearing like, you've got to become a designer.
And I'm like, man, what? But the more I said in stillness, the more clarity that her wisdom was coming through and was like, you've gotta go to New York and become a designer. I was like, I just finished this house, I'm stillness now I'm go back to New York and start over. And I don't, in my head once before, I'm like, are you sure you're, are you sure you're higher wisdom over here?
'cause this sounds crazy to me, but. Would not let go. And I finally visited the New York school of interior design. I applied, it was in like a spring of 2009, maybe. And I was starting school that next fall and everyone thought I had lost my mind. And I thought I lost my mind because when I started design school, see, this has taken longer to get to this.
This is too long already. I love it. No, keep going. But this is important. This is important. This, this piece of advice is what also was one of those. Moments that kind of saved me from, yeah, and I think that's what it is to be an entrepreneur and to have a business is resiliency. Being resilient and having fortitude, but not listening to that part of us, that inner critic that can say, you're not capable of this.
You can't do this. You're not like, you're not as good as they are. You. We all have those kind of, the war within is what I kind of call it. It's like, which wolf are you feeding? Right. That's so important. But I started design school and. All these students were artists. I mean, the things they were drawing and sketching, and I was not good at, I mean, I couldn't, my orange didn't even look like an orange with the shell.
I mean, it was like, what, what, what is that? It's a rotten orange. And I was like, this was after the one week. And I'm like, I'm, I'm not gonna make it. I'm gonna have to quit. I'm have to go home. I'm be so embarrassed. And we have, the first lecture of the semester happened to be the following Monday after I've been there a week, and he started his whole lecture with this.
He said, now, listen up, he's like, interior design is 10 percent creativity and 90 percent execution. And if you don't know how to execute, no matter how creative you are, you will never make it. And I thought to myself, I'm going to be just fine because I knew that from my experience as a real estate agent and relationships that, yeah, it is a lot.
More than just finding the house for someone. It's like seeing the transaction through. And so the visioning part is the fun part, right? And helping come up with the, but then the execution is just as important. And even what is it? The last lingering little things that you would, when I ask clients today, like when you worked as a designer in the past, what, what did you love about it?
When didn't you like about it? And it's always the same things. One over budget or it wasn't enough budget to go around to finish it, or they'd ever come back to finish the little things. And so I paid attention to all those. Those things. And I think that's what has served me well. And why I think as a designer in a design business is a relationship business.
And it is a referral based business. We don't take out a lot of billboards. You don't necessarily run a lot of ads. It's like you do an amazing job. People come to the house, they ask their clients or the clients are so happy with what you've done and you're like, Oh God, you have to work my designer. And that organically is how my business was built and I know yours and so many other designers that I know, and that's how it happens.
But it's from conception to completion that you've got to have that full engagement and be there. I always tell my clients like this is going to be stressful. It can be at times, and there's going to be times of the different phases of the, actually this past year, I created like phases of a design project and we'll walk them through the beginning because setting expectations, one of the lessons in our last year is so important because.
If they don't have any idea about how your business works and oftentimes people don't even realize they think we're just shopping for pretty things. Exactly. No clue what goes into it in terms of that. We even are a business, right? That we're just not having fun. Yeah. Yeah. We're just a shop, shopping, picking out pretty things and making mood boards.
And it's like, um, but then how are we going to have all the logistics and stuff and really, Yeah, getting it into your house in one piece after all the design scenes of the returning of the thing and the damage thing that we had to get fixed and have all of that maneuvering. Yeah. I have one client this past year who put it in the best terms for me.
That now I open up every conversation with, and he happens to be, it was the writer, director, creator of like Frazier and wings. And so again, people want to, that is, but big deal and great writer. So very concise, not like me with words, but he said, I finally get it. At the end of the project, he's like, I finally get it.
He's like, interior designers are responsible for everything. But I have control over nothing like that's exactly what it is. We are responsible for everything, but have control over none of it. We are just like herding cats half the time. And unless you start delegating that responsibility, which is a hard thing to do sometimes.
Well, yeah, but I answer it at the end of the day, you try to assemble the best vendors and relationships that you can. You're team members, but team members sometimes have things they're going on, personalizing, and so you just, you're responsible for it. I asked you Josh, before we get into like the business, I really want to dive into the business side of things, because I feel like you and I are aligned in a lot of ways on the business side of things.
And also just, just public perception and marketing and all the things, but back to your story of how you got to where you are and the things that happened to you in your life, good and bad along the way. I kind of feel like it is a, we have this bucket and we're picking up these stones along our life and we're putting these stones into a bucket and then before you know it, the buckets full of these stones.
And then it's what do you do with those? But you, you just picked up a lot of different things along the way that made you. Who you are today as a, as we all do as a human being and as a, as a, as a business owner and as a person and as an interior designer. So do you look back at that and, and have any special moments of like, yes, that was meant to be that this is, I don't have those regrets.
Like some people might have in this negative situation because of all the bad things that happened. Some people to look back on that and feel really bad about it, but. Do you look at that more of a learning lesson for yourself and where that's taken you now and propelled you into a successful career?
Yeah, so I would say now, it's one of those things where I trust that everything that's happened up until this point has made me who I am today. And It's not that I feel this way every day, but I am at a place where I can say I love myself and I can see and appreciate all the things that I do really well and all my strengths and also see the things where it's like, those are not necessarily my strengths and that I'm a human being and I have to embrace my humanness and I'm always going to be, I had this perfection.
Perfectionist that many designers do, which also like in proportion makes us great at what we do when it's out of proportion, it becomes an inner cricket. I'm the person that doesn't go outward with it towards other people. It goes inward towards me. And this is where meditation and mindfulness has been such a huge part.
I think of me and my, the healing journey, right? And we're constantly. Curve balls in life. I love this expression. There's like being human being. It's like having five trash cans and only four lids at any given time. There's going to be some area of your life that needs a little bit of extra attention.
And I have found that to be true for myself and many others. I've also professional coach and coaching certification and worked with people in that capacity to are more of a personal development, holistic kind of thing. And I love that because I do feel like it's all interconnected. And what I realized early on too, is that like.
We had so much of the body, mind, spirit conversation, but we weren't talking about it, how our environment impacts that and can support that or detract that, like I'll say your home could be your stressor or your sanctuary, but it can't be both or our spaces are an outward reflection of our inner state of mind.
And I know that if there's tons of dishes and things are all, it's like, okay, you need to pause because there's something going on here. That's not about not taking the time to do the dishes. There's other you're in your head or something. So this is a lot, but it can't fix everything. Yes. Right. Yeah. Like, yes, exactly.
And you, they can be a kind of a little telltale sign of like, there's something going on that you're so distracted. And so I'm focused that you. If you're letting this slip, then you're probably letting other things slip too, is what I thought myself. And so it's kind of like just learning your operating system.
And we all have different operating systems. And so sometimes it's not like, okay, it's time to do an upgrade, but there are also times where we are in the moment of those things happening in life. Another big lesson this year was the word and, and has been such a huge word for me this year, because I kind of, and this is.
I'm going to talk about how we really show up every day from our unemotional mental, physical landscape, which is so important in what we do, because it's all those things to run a business. But also ours is constantly like carrying and loading, doing things, even though you're not doing heavy lifting, like you're still very engaged in so many things, but you can only give energy that you are cultivating.
It's kind of like replenishing your tank. And what I realized is I had started running on empty tank. Last year. And instead of stopping and pausing and saying, how do I replenish, recharge that Tesla battery or whatever you want to do these days, I kept just trying to push through it. And I was what I call empty tank syndrome.
And if you have empty tank syndrome, you are not going to be doing your best. You think you just need to get through it and then you'll be okay, but it's like. But there's no just getting through it because there's always the next thing and the next thing and the next thing. Right. And so, but it's so counterintuitive to say, hold on, I need to take a pause.
I need to stop. I need to get still. I maybe need to take a week off, which I did actually in September and say, I need for my own sanity and to recharge my batteries a week. I need to just shut down, turn off the world and go within. And when I've done those things, even on a, I do it on a daily basis. I'm a morning meditator.
I get it very early. I have a morning practice, and it is when I do that consistently, I am able to go into the stillness, still the body, quiet the mind, and then my heart feels safe to open. And from that place is where I can access higher wisdom, higher love, and totally God presence, whatever you choose to identify with that voice that is of love.
compassion, empathy. And those are the things that I learned from the really challenging experiences. I know what it's like to not have a roof over your head. I know what it's like to not know where you're going to get your next bill. Those things have given me probably the heart that I do have today.
And in a way that I do it, or otherwise I might just have taken so many things for granted and that, and I don't. But the word and is so important because even though I could look back at last year, which I was doing and say, I'm like, Oh my gosh, that's the worst year of my life on so many levels, but that's not entirely true.
And many people, we kind of can have black and white thinking, right? But the truth is, is it's like it's somewhere in the middle and they used to say, there will still be like, Oh, it's in the gray. And I'm like, but I don't want to be in the gray. I like color. And you know what happened? I had this experience.
I was journaling one morning and I wanted to change up on color and I saw the black and I saw the white and it was color all in between. I'm like, wait. in between black and white is color. So it's like, I can totally be in this. And the other thing where the and comes in is like every day I have started to, I would wake up and I actually also was suffering with chronic pain for seven years.
Up until this year, till I got to the root cause of some of that. And some of it was old emotions and traumas that I would have told you I'd already worked through were still trapped in my body. And it wasn't until I started doing different types of therapies and, and things and having awarenesses around that my mind knew it was in the past, but my body had not because I had stuffed my feelings for so long.
I didn't want to ask for help. I needed to be independent. I had to take care of myself. I had to, all those things that, that we bottle and stuff. I'm kind of taught not to express, like, I'm having a hard time. I could use some support. I could never imagine saying that. And like, what does it even mean?
Right? It's like, I need some support, but you don't really need anything. You're just saying it's going to help you. Like what? So it is a continuing evolution as a human being, a personal development that helps you continue to learn and grow. And we get into, it's like peeling back the layers of an onion, right?
You get. Deeper places, but the word and has been so helpful. 'cause I would wake up in the morning and be like, oh my God, I'm overwhelmed and stressed. I gotta do this there. I gotta get, I don't know how we're gonna get all this done. We got this install coming up and that thing. And so, and then off and running, I would go.
What I do now though is I'm not stressed. I'm not overwhelmed. I'm not anxious. I'm not joy. I'm not happiness. I am actually the observer of these emotions that just happen to be present. What? Boom. This has changed my life in a way and seriously, because now is no over identification with the dominant. Oh my God.
I'm so anxious and so stressed out because that filters down into your team. Right. They're going to pick up on it. Your class are going to pick on her, even if you're putting on a good face, even if you think you're showing up people, since something is not normal or the stress or whatever. So, which is like, not even whatever it is about, I'm all about blissful living.
And I have a, how do, how do you create that from nothing? And, and so this was why it was such a weird year for me. Cause I'm like, wait, hold on a second. Like my life looks perfect on the outside, be it inside. I feel so disconnected from self and I'm still doing all the things that I did. Like, I just couldn't make sense of it.
Taking time and sitting in the stillness is like when you will get your answers and it's almost like when you were told when you were sitting in that stillness back in Texas as a real estate agent and you were heard that voice that said, Oh, I want you need to be a designer. You listened to that voice and so many times a lot of us shun that voice and don't listen to it and we don't pay attention to it, but if we really listen to that voice, it's telling us, it's usually telling us the truth because it's coming from a place inside of us that knows.
The fricking true. Then it knows exactly what we need to do. So if we listen to it, it will, it will usually lead us to the right path on the right pathway with the right steps, even to get there. And that is what I've learned when I look back at the past. It's like, when I take the time to make sure it's like, okay, before you make major decisions about your business, your personal life, anything who's driving the car right now, is this thing stressed out?
Eight year old that you're giving, letting drive the car. The one that's like the integrates is like, or is this the one that's like softer, gentler, more compassionate, more loving. That's the one that should be driving the car is the, is, is the parent. You know, it's like stressed out. I understand you're scared.
I understand you're worried about this and this and this, and you need to get in the back seat. And I've got this adult. Me knows how to do this. Sometimes it's literally having those conversations with myself, but this morning practice now that I'm doing where it's like. I am saying, okay, what emotions are present today?
Well, anxiousness is present because we got two installs back to back right before Thanksgiving and one right after Thanksgiving, the way these are falling. That's it. Okay. Anxious. This is present. Makes sense. What else is yeah. I'm over because I've got to get all this other stuff done. I've committed to this, this and this also family obligations, responsibilities.
So how am I going to juggle all that? And then if I get to a third one, it's like more on the shadowy side. are more on the light side. None of it's good or bad. It's just, it's just what is, but if they're on the more on the shadowy side, I challenge myself and say, can you just find one other emotion that's present that is on the lighter side?
And usually of course, I look over and I see maybe in the morning, my dog, I'm like, love that I have for these dogs is present for sure. And so this helps me like almost feel like I'm extracting some of this, like toxic stress out of my body in a way because I'm not it. I'm just the observer of these things that are present.
And I didn't know that we were capable of feeling multiple emotions at one time, but it's the one we get the most power to is the one that's going to rule the day. And the only way we get to do this is if we take the time in the morning to get still do that, because the days that I'm running late for some whatever reason, I run out the door or whatever and don't do my morning practice.
Like I'm just kind of at the mercy of whatever is happening, reacting. Right. Whereas in the mornings, I get to make the conscious choice that says, you know what? I'm going to align with this love that I have for this dog today. I'm going to let that be my guiding force. And I'm going to show up in this situation with a client and a builder that may have been super challenging.
And I've been getting an attitude. I'm like, I'm going to show them. I don't have to put up with this anymore. I did that in my whole life. That is like, that's not me. That is the defensive younger Josh that was not going to be pushed around and bullied anymore. It's harder to be the peaceful warrior to say, I'm, I'm not going to engage in this.
And I'm just going to continue to show up. With the love and light that I'm committed to and trust that the rest of it will fall into place. But what's interesting is when you do that, everything around you seems to change. Right. Yep. Totally. Interesting how it's like there's been several situations in my career where it's like when I changed my behavior.
Um, how I was responding, even though maybe I was totally justified, it seems like it got mirrored back. Yeah. I think, but I think what I'm here, gosh, there's so much in there to unpack for people and for myself and for everybody. But I, I just, what I'm hearing is I think it was Oprah that said it feel the feel, but then take the wheel.
So you feel the feeling. Of what you feel, right? So you feel that, but then you, you, you take action, right? On the things that need to take action on. And some things are just feelings. Some things are just there. It's, it's how you react to that, right? Yes. Feelings are not facts. It's. Energy in motion, emotions, right?
And so it's energy that needs to move through you. Where it gets to be a problem is what I was doing for years, which is like, I didn't want it to hurt my feelings. I didn't want it to cause problems in a relationship. It's like, well, you got to pick your battles. So it was like, well, I don't want this to upset me.
So I'm just not going to say anything. So I just stuffed and stuffed and stuffed and stuffed and never gave myself time to say, you know, what is so sad that you didn't get this project that you've been interviewing for three months and you're, you're devastated. Of course you are. It makes total sense you would be because you were so excited about it and you thought you were going to get it and you didn't, for example, and so you give yourself time and space to be devastated and you need to, because that is actually justified as grief.
Right? So you feel it, you eat your bucket of ice cream or whatever you need to do that day. And then you say, okay, well now, what do I want to do with this? Do I want to stay in this place or do I want to focus my energy and attention on something else? But I definitely want to give myself time to feel the feels.
Yes. Don't get stuck there. Don't get stuck in your story. Because the more we complain about it, like, oh, I can't believe this happened to me, and da, da, da, da. And it's like, we start rattling off all that. We're going to get stuck in our stories, and we're just going to perpetuate more of that. Because I've also done that in times in my life, and had to be like, okay, I've clearly gone off course here.
Let me pivot back. And so that's a lot of what this is. It's like, we're not going to do it perfectly, but if we can learn from each one of those experiences, hopefully we don't make the decision next time. Or what I call the comeback ratio. When I start to get off my center, how quickly can I get back? My comeback ratio is getting better and better.
Good. Okay. That's improved. I'm in right. And so, and one thing I do, you mentioned like having a busy day and a busy schedule and all the things happening is sometimes if you just refocus on how you look at things, it, your whole perception can change. So. I looked at it as I get to do these things versus I have to do these things.
So it's my instead of my to do list, it's my I get to do list, right? So I get to I get to install a beautiful home. I get to work with great clients like not that I have to do these things. And it's amazing when you just change your perception. Of what you have in front of you, the day, the hour, the month, the year can go so much easier and it just, it just, it just feels less cumbersome and less of a chore when you look at it like a blessing and like a positive thing versus always a negative thing because busy is sometimes good because think about how blessed you are to be busy and to have this opportunities in front of you, right?
Right. Yeah. I think you're exactly right. And that is how I'd operated for, I would say 17 years on that, on that journey. But the part that I was missing was when I couldn't get there and I had other times been able to flip into the right perspective, then that inner critic was saying, What is wrong with you?
Like, look at this amazing life you've had, and you can't feel more gratitude, more grateful. Like, why are you so uncomfortable? Why are you so stressed? Why are you complaining all the time? Like you, what is wrong with you? And so that's not a good place to get into either, because then it was like, I've always been able to kind of come back so quick.
Like what's going on. And then life sometimes. Things are going to happen, right? Like someone's going to pass away. A relationship may end. There may be all sorts of things that are impacting you in a way that like harder than normal to do these things. And this is where it's so important to have a good support network of friends that can speak this language that are also trying to be.
Is this a, is this a problem or is this an opportunity? Right. Same kind of language. I can see that. So this little stone says problem and this little stone says solution. Okay. On my desk. And if I start to get into the problem, I have to flip it to the problem. And like, you're clearly the problem. And like, I love it.
Oh, I love it. Just flip it over and see the solution. I'm just like, okay. Are you, do you want to get in the solution now? Okay, now you have to be in the solution. And that's so good Josh. Recently, because I had been in a period where I had taken on too much, my business was growing and expanding. I didn't exactly know where I was going.
I was trying to do more things than anyone is possibly capable of in hindsight and had moved so many. I was just like, what in the world? But things were going so fast and I wasn't taking the time to slow down enough time and space. It's so important. However, we get it because it is in those places where you like stop that you get to make the choice to like flip it.
Flip script to pivot. Yeah, and you said something earlier that you talked about your morning routine and your morning rituals. And I feel like as well, that's super important to me too. I do that every day. Unfortunately, I think a lot of designers, a lot of business owners, a lot of entrepreneurs jump right into the day, pick up their phone from the side of their bed, start looking at emails, start checking social media, start letting the world bombard us with everything around us.
Right. How important it's, it's, it's honestly, it is vital to my day is vital to my success to have that me time in the morning. But for you, how important is it for you? It sounds like it's critical to everything that happens in your day. I have been consistent with a morning routine for over 18 years. It is changed and evolved with how I do it.
But the key is you're right, once you pick up your phone, even if I do this, if I look at an email or an Instagram or something before I do my morning practice, it's over. Even as resilient and as much as I've flexed this morning muscle and know how important it is to my day, I'm down the, I'm down the rabbit hole.
I do not even look at my phone until I've done my morning practice, period. It started off where I was doing what I call the three fives, five minutes of meditation, five minutes of either affirmations, prayers, reading something. And then the other five minutes was journaling. And what I found in that process was like, once I kind of quieted the mind and then kind of affirmed or set intentions or whatever I wanted to do during the other five minutes, and then wrote, sometimes it's like just automatic writing, right.
Or sometimes I had prompts depending on where I was, but like.
Um, and I was like, well, that's actually what I was been trying to figure out. And then here it was just flew right out. Right. But it's because I, oh, and I didn't realize at the time, but it's kind of the same thing I was talking about. It's like, I opened up that place in myself and got still enough for that quieter voice to kind of come through the writing to kind of get me the answers or the direction I was looking for.
And so, yeah, I tell people, just start with that and then expand on it if you want to. But if you at least just do those things, I'm telling you, it will transform your life. Agreed. Yes. And then I've actually been doing this because I started to really get really critical of myself is like three things that I like about myself from the day before that I did well, because we're so used to picking ourselves apart or focusing on what we didn't, we didn't do right.
I realized even last year, even though it was one of the most. Outwardly successful, like I finally gotten published in magazines and won some awards and things. I wasn't stopping up to celebrate those because I was rushing through all the other stuff. And so this Christmas break, I was like, you know what?
I'm taking another time and space, a time and space, because that is when I need these fragmented parts of this year to kind of like make sense to me because I'm not understanding exactly how all this has unfolded and sort of way that doesn't feel like the inside matches the outside. And that had never been that way before I talk about living a blissful life.
But I was like, I can't connect to it and this feels almost like fraudulent in a way. But what it was, was the sky is always blue. Always. There may be storm clouds that cover the entire blue sky, but you know that above those storm clouds, the sky is still blue. Or you can be so concerned and scared of the storm that you're in that you forget the sky is blue, that the winds will blow and the storm clouds will part.
You'll start to see glimpses of blue and eventually one day there'll be a clear blue sky again. It's an and. I can be. Loving and so grateful for my business and my team and my clients and my husband and my dogs. And I can still be grieving because I made some decisions that I'm not happy with, or I wish I'd have done differently, or I have an unhappy client.
I'm taking it very personally. It's like two truths can coexist at the same time. And I had no idea that till last year, really. And that's okay that they do, right? It's okay that they live side by side, right? Actually, there's usually multiple truths can exist at the same time. Of course. And it's just the one that we, like you said, it's like, I've got to take whatever I need to do to, to pull back enough to say, I'm not going to get swept out with a current of this particular one.
I'm going to keep it all in perspective. Let's talk about perspective. I love that you and I were chatting before, and we were talking about when you reach a certain point in your career, no matter what the industry, honestly, no matter what you're doing, but when you're an entrepreneur and you and I both have our names on our company, right?
So our company is our name and. For better or worse. That's the way it is. Sometimes I've honestly regretted it. Sometimes I wish I'd been called at me design company, but exactly. Or like I cannot be involved in it. Yes. Yeah, but it is what it is. So. From that perspective, I think a lot of clients sometimes expect to see Josh Smith come out and greet them and do all the things with their project and, and, or John McClane over the past year, you said that you've navigated some rough waters.
You've seen some things happen. So what have you seen happen over the past year that has opened up your eyes that maybe you want to do differently and to change that perspective, or maybe you have, maybe you don't want to change that perspective. Maybe you want to be more involved. Maybe you do want to be.
The face and all the things with your company, but what, what do you see changing for 2024 after this introspective year that you've had in 2023, after seeing all the fragments that you've seen, but you spent that time putting them back together, what do you want to see form itself in the 2024 based upon what you learned in 2023, because you've had a lot of changes you're in, you're in Vermont now, and let's just clear, let's just clear all this up.
He is in Vermont, but he works everywhere, right? Yes. That's one of the things that I learned. We'll talk about that, but like. Yes, I have my primary residence is now in Manchester area of Vermont. I'm Southern Vermont and I have a studio space. Now I've sourced French antiques and like going buying trips and we'll eventually have time to open this up to the public right now.
It's pop ups when, when they're signed. But my mom's actually going to be living up here from Texas and she's going to be helping out up here some, and we'll do some lifestyle events, meditations, book signings. So it's going to be really great. I'm in this old historic building in town. It's gonna be fun.
But I was also trying to get that off the ground and. I'm from Cherish while running a design business that was growing and busier than ever. So I took on a lot, a lot of things. And that's one of the lessons I learned is think about. So one exercise that I employ is look at every project that I have in about how many hours a week do I think I'm going to have to spend on this client and I need my team to do the same.
And if we're in an excess of like, wait, there's not even enough hours in the day, even if we work 12 hour days. To really give good service to these other projects. And it's like, we're kind of capacity and we need to be responsible enough to know that because I pride myself on doing an amazing job and making it lighter and much more of a fun experience because it can be stressful and it can be overwhelming.
And I want to bring some lightness and levity to it. Cause it doesn't have to be, we're just like, sometimes I'm like, y'all, this is just draperies, like everybody's settled down. Like this is where, let's just talk about how grateful it is that we're getting to do these custom throw pillows to you right now with all this contrasting well and banding.
And this also happening over here too. And you've worked hard to have this and let's just keep it in perspective. And so I do that a lot and, and we'll make sure that I've got to do that for me too. Cause I can get like, Oh my God, I can't believe I got to tell them that, I don't know if it's going to be delayed.
And it's like, Josh is a chair. They're going to have plenty of other places to sit. If this one gets delayed another two weeks, it's going to be okay. You don't got to, you don't need to lose sleep over having to deliver this news. But there was a real fear of like, again, if you're not coming from a place of, of real confidence, it's all about delivering the confidence in how you present and how you deliver the information in the news.
And they, again, pick up what you're putting down. People do. They want to trust and know that you're the expert. They want to trust and know that you know what you're doing. And the more confidence that you exude when communicating about. Any and every part of the project, the less they have to feel like they have to be in control.
And sometimes we get these clients that they're used to being in that or their business owners or their whatever are very successful. And so they're used to running it. And so like releasing some of that, it's like sometimes those are my clients. Do you go to the doctor and tell them what's what?
Everything that, do you tell your attorney that? Do you tell all these other experts? How many houses have you done? They're like by yourself from, from conception to completion. And she looked at me and she said, I know where you're going. I'm like, I'm just curious. I'm just curious because I do believe in co creation.
I do love my clients involved and I want their personalities and all that involved. But if it's, if I strongly feel like it's the wrong choice, I'm going to let you know. And I tell them, I said, I get veto power and you do too in some things, but I'm going to tell you if it doesn't work, why it doesn't work.
And so I was just going to be like, it's just a note. There's going to be design casualties in every project, but. And the beginning of my career, I was afraid to say that because I was like, it's their home. But if I knew they were, they're trusting me as the expert and they want me to actually. And, and so again, learning those things as you grow your business.
But last year was really more about logistics of running a business and profitability. I used to say, it's like, yeah, I want to have a really successful design firm. And of course your definition of success can be many different things, right? And often it is many different components of that. And I think being, I'm not a numbers person.
I don't like numbers. I've had to learn how to make friends with them and like, wait, I'm working this hard and more hours, but I'm not more profitable. Like what, what's happening? So what I learned this year was like, I have got to restructure how I'm doing my business because I was so also so kind and nice in a way that I was giving so much more than I was getting.
Or a lot of people that I've talked to had these scenarios where if you're in the old model of. I get a design fee upfront for the decoration, and then I get commission on what you spend. And you told me and said that your budget was this. And so that I have my pipeline. It's like, yep. Okay. Then if I'm a boutique firm and I don't want to grow and expand any larger because I don't want to be an operations people, I want to be decorating and designing and sourcing too, then I only can take on so many at a time.
But if you have one or two of those that for whatever reason, that one, that the kids started a new school and they weren't sure if their kids were going to be happy there, so they may. Move. So they were like paused and didn't order anything for five months. I accept the two kids rooms. They wanted to make sure there's research done.
I was like, okay, well, this is interesting. Okay. But then I had another one that had a very large budget. She decided to just randomly quit her job and was not going to, I'm just going to retire. She was done. And so what was going to be a whole full scale redecoration of the 5, 000 square foot house, she decided to do two rooms instead.
It's the bottom line. Doesn't it? Yeah, and it's like, well, we've already been working together for six months and like source this whole house basically, and the schemes and now we're not going to order anything. So it was like, okay, well, this is not necessarily a problem because I have a good pipeline, but like the cashflow gets really tight, really quick if you have.
Overhead, right? And I had had two new people and was also sharing. I'm a virtual office, which there's learning curves with that too. And I think I've learned what works well and what doesn't. And now we've been able to pivot and accommodate for that in a way that makes that more effective. But working in California, working in New York city, all the way up to Vermont, it's a lot to navigate even losing travel days, right?
It's like, you don't get to be in the office and then you're with clients those days. It's like, well, when are you doing your actual work? Your work or your meetings with your, the senior designer and you're giving them feedback advice. They're asking you, but then you had to do your parts. Like, well, if you're on the road all the time, when are you getting to do that part?
Your to do list is getting longer and longer. You being more hands on now? Are you being more, are you being more, you hate numbers, but are you in the numbers more? Are you seeing? Yes. More of what's happening, because I encourage that. Well, I was going to say, well, this is where the shift is happening. So, I realized that I'm in this because I want to impact people's lives in a positive way.
Because I do believe that when we live better, we feel better. And when we feel better, we do better in the world. And so that's always been like, my mission is to bring love, light, and beauty to the world. That's beautiful, but we're not a nonprofit either. Right. So you're right. And at the same time, it's like, wait, hold on.
I'm working this hard at the end of the day. It's like, everybody's kind of winning in a way. And I just get to feel good. Cause I've done some service. It's like, but I, my dogs need new shoes. It's like, I got, I got, I got a sunrise. I got to like, make sure I get to enjoy. So I had this, I needed a new pair of shoes.
Who knows exactly. I mean, gosh, heaven forbid. Right. Like. Ever forget, I get new throw pillows. So, so what, so yeah, so I realized it's not even as much was even about the bottom line is like, I don't want to stress. I don't distress of worrying about like, is this going to be a tight cashflow month? Am I going to need to ask for a line of credit extension at some point?
What do I have to do? And what happened was during that short period, I had to take on extra work that I knew we didn't really have time for because I wanted to not lose these people that I had, that we've been working with for over a year and finally. Found our flow and so I said, then I'm gonna have to change the way I'm doing my business, my pricing structure.
And I'd started doing this on the architectural side where I kind of do it in two ways. It's like the architecture, everything that would stay with the house if you moved is in one category and the decorative is another. The architecture, if I'm doing the full scale, it's like a percentage of the construction.
Usually if I'm doing the whole thing and instead of doing like a third, a third, a third. Or whatever I decided we're going to start with what we think is going to cost. And I'm going to take the commission and divide up into monthly payments. And then when we get the actual bid, we are going to then reassess on what we're spending.
And we will adjust that monthly payment accordingly over the duration of that entire construction project. I know every month I'm going to get. And they know every month what they're going to be sending out. So we had the permitting department and home stream shut down for four months. So it was like, okay, so I'm not going to get to the place where I'm going to get an installment because we don't have started construction for four months.
Can you get a permit? So all those, I mean, it was just so many of those kind of moments happened last year that created so much stress that was unnecessary. And then I'm not giving my best work at the creative side because I'm trying to figure out how to make sure this all flows effectively and efficiently and juggling things that has really solved that.
Now, it never occurred to me to do that on the decorative side, but after I'd kind of had all these situations, I had someone come to me and he's a great referral source. He says, I have this client. You will love her. She's coming back from London. She's. Just bought this pieta terrace has to be a penthouse, but it's just a one bedroom with a wrap around three sided terrace near city.
I'm like, Oh, that sounds amazing. And it's the one bedroom. So like markup, it's not really probably going to do it on 800 square feet. Right. For, and I'm already swamped. So I'm like, I don't know how to do that. He's like, we'll just talk to her. Just talk to her. She's, she's amazing. And she's in finance.
She's a smart woman. And just, just. Just be transparent like you always are with everybody and I am. I'm always just like, I'll tell classes, look, it needs to be a win-win. Like you need to do what you need to do and get what you need to get. But I also have to run a profitable business. And so we have to, yeah.
And I need to still be in business a year from now if you need something. So pay me enough to still be in business a year from now . Right, exactly. It's like, and again, it's like having these transparent conversations. You start to build trust and respect and like, look, I wanna make it work. And so if I need to restructure maybe the way I price something, if you can.
Present something to me that you feel more comfortable with that. I feel comfortable with, I'm happy to do it your way. I'm not that rigid and I welcome it. And this case, this was one of those where I really learned. She said, I want you to do my space. I've never lived with color. And I know you do work with a lot of muted and serene place.
She's like, I want a lot of color in this place. Cause I've always lived in neutrals. Can you do it? I said, honey, I've been waiting 10 years for somebody to ask me to do tons of color. I could do it. So then I'm like, okay, I'm like, now I want to do the project. I like her, but I'm like, cause it's going to be profitable.
And so I just was like really transparent. Look, what do you think your budget would. Would be on, on this one bedroom. And she's like, well, I mean, gosh, it's only eight or four feet. So maybe it's like, I don't hate to put out numbers, but like say a hundred thousand, which is a hypothetical. And I was like, well, if that's the top, then you subtract.
So then it was like, Oh, so you made 23, 000 commission on that over the course of six, that's not going to cut it. Right. So yeah. So I said, you know what? I would love to, I said that I have chosen to stay very boutique and very hands on with my clients. I said, because I love that. And I love relationship building and I love being apart and weird and friends, and I'm like, I'm being your life for a long time.
As we were talking about earlier, it's such, so neat to like design. A room for a young girl when she was eight and then have her graduate high school last year. And I've been working with the family the whole time. So you get to be a part of all these special moments and experiences. So she said, well, what do you need to take this project?
I'm like, well, and I didn't know how to even really communicate it. Cause I felt like the money conversation is always a hard one. Right? So I was like, you know what? I usually don't take projects that are less than at least 350, 000. I said, otherwise. It takes up a spot. It's can be the same amount of work sometimes sourcing for a one bedroom.
It can be for a two bedroom. And so I just probably can't take that spotless is that she said, well, what if I paid you that commission, regardless of what I spend? And I was like, Hmm, and she's audience. And she's like, what if I just said, what if we do this? She's like, what if we say, I'm going to pay you commission for 350, 000.
We'll break that up into three payments. We'll do one at the beginning. We'll do one when we go to order and then one before you install. And then I would pass on my net pricing to her. So I would be guaranteed by, and I was like, wait, I will return. Yeah, I was like, wait, I was trying to figure that. I'm like, okay, let's try it.
Let's try it. Let's see how it works. So she's become, I adore her. We just installed apartment. She loved the whole process. I did too. I'm like going forward. This is how I'm going to do it. In order to have a spot, you'll have to commit to a budget. And no matter, I get life circumstances happen and things change, but I need to know that I'm going to get at least this much for the time it's going to take me and my team to Procure, receive, inspect, return, hold, install, you know, everything, all people have no idea how many hours it takes to do all of that stuff.
And like you said, sometimes I figured out who I am as a person by figuring out who I'm not right in my business. I've learned what to do sometimes by learning what not to do well. And to me, it sounds like what you did with that, with that particular client was. It was basically set your minimum design fee, your minimum fee to do the project, really.
So you can look at it in one of two ways. So now you can say like, Oh, my minimum fee to take on any project is X to do that. So you don't even have to base it really off of a commission necessarily, right? You can just say, my minimum fee is this, and now I can go to any project, no matter if it's. 200 square feet or whatever and say for me to even consider your project, it's going to be this and you can even talk about that on discovery calls now on the phone call on an email on your website if you wanted to wherever and just put it right out there and I think that that's what I did and it started weeding out those people.
Who really, sometimes people have no business hiring as a designer. Let's be honest about it. Sometimes, sometimes, and I don't, I don't mean that in a bad way. I mean that because it's a luxury field we're in. Right. And I think you've just realized it's kind of what your barrier to entry is for someone who wants to work with you by, by setting that fee.
And that's a, that's a exhilarating place to be, isn't it? It is because like I said, I had those where it's like, I thought the budget was going to be okay because they said that's what they were going to spend. And so. But my contract was not set ups that that would be kind of what I was going to get for the time involved in that.
And so I literally am having my contract. I think we have 15 things that we're changing in the contract based on we have a list like all year, like all the lessons we've learned that like we need to tighten up here and I presenting it differently. I'm talking about it differently, and I'm finding that people are responding and they understand what I kind of just, let me tell you how it works.
Let me, from my side of things, I want this to be a win win, really. People want to know, they want to be led. A consumer shouldn't be driving our business. We should be driving the business side of our companies. And we should be saying, here's how we operate. And here's how we run a project. And here's how we charge.
And when I started doing that, I broke mine up into creative. And then Project Fulfillment, and then I do production. So if someone purchases my creative package, which is basically saying, I'm going to come up with all the beautiful things for your space. You can take that and run with it if you want, but I know that I've been paid enough to do what we love to do as designers, right?
And if they don't, then it's okay. They can move on. But you know, nine times out of 10, they don't know how to do it. And it's not their forte and all the things. And we're very, very good at it as a design team. But I know that for me, once I started doing that, it kind of compartmentalized that for people to understand like, Oh, okay, I'm going to pay for this.
And then I'm going to pay for this. And I'm going to pay for this. And then they're going to execute the entire plan for me because they're really damn good at it. That's what we do. Right? Exactly. Exactly. And it's like, I, we did a lot of that where it's like, this was really about setting expectations for people and they don't know what they don't know.
Just like we didn't know what we didn't know about running a business. No, we're in design school where they're really like, here's business one on one or here's like how to, it's like, you just have to kind of really thank God for podcasts like this and, and others. And even when I started, it's like, there wasn't, I don't know, I feel like I didn't really know a lot of other designers even ask what they were doing or how they were doing it, but that's why going to hide you did.
They're like, no, I can't tell you. I can't tell you. No, no, no. Yeah. There was some of that for sure. And then going to high point and like. Kind of connecting with other people and just like the transparency and everybody helping everybody. Cause it's like the abundant mentality. Like there is enough business for everybody.
There is an use. It's like, it's some people just want different perspectives and they relate and click with different people. Just like I do. It's like I have three requirements when I take on the project. One, am I excited about the project? Number two, do I like the person, the people? And number three, is it profitable?
And if it is not all three of those things, it's a no. It's just a no. Easy. That's easy. I love it. Because before it'd be like, well, but it's two out of three. So maybe it's going to be a no. I don't have to, um, Nope. You create the space and the universe will make sure that it gets filled. Because. What we're doing is we know we do a good job.
We know we get great service. I'm not going to live in scarcity mindset. That is brilliant. It is. It's so simple, but it is so truthful and so honest. And I think if we just all broke it down to those simple three steps of taking on a project, then there are no other ifs, ands or buts to, to move into it.
Right. Talk to other designers and about last year, we've all kind of had this. Kind of year, it seems like, I mean, I think this is, I'm even doing an article about it where they talked about, like, it was a big lesson learning year for everyone and even talking to some other designers, it was kind of like your gut feeling was like, Hmm, I probably shouldn't take this.
I probably should take this project. I don't know if this is a good fit for me with the person that the, but the, it's a good project and the profits are good. Maybe I should. And then, you know, they shouldn't, but they did. And sure enough, they were like, Oh my God. And it's just like, it's just not worth it.
And sometimes it does take, take being around a while to know that like. Yeah. And this is the other big lesson that we talked about right before. It was like, we, we worked so hard at building a brand. And having your brand and if you're your brand clarity is so important because what happens with many small businesses, especially the beginning when you're learning, it's like you have these peaks and valleys, peaks and valleys, right?
And it's like, Oh gosh, I was so busy doing all the projects that I did all that business time development to get. And then now, oops, we've installed now nothing. Cause I stopped doing business filament. What am I doing? Here we go. And so last year was probably the first year that I started to get. A lot of press and it's kind of that saying it takes 10 years to be an overnight success.
It was like, I got like emerging designer of the year in California. I'm like emerging. I'm like, I've been around for a little while, but I was emerging to them and being a nutritionalist or whatever. And August was all amazing things and having stuff in national publications, which I. So rewarding people reach out and say, Oh my gosh, your work so inspired me.
It's like, that's what I wanted to do. It's like, I remember being person inspired, looking at the magazine and now I get to be that person was just like full circle moment. But what was happening is because I had moved because I was loading up a studio and there was press around me now. And like I'm quoted in different, different writers will come to me and say like, Hey.
What's your opinion on this? And it, there's so many content that's created today that are quoted in many places, but I wasn't paying enough attention. And somehow the New York and California got dropped off. It just said, Joshua Smith of Vermont. When I looked back at like the past four months. And they're like, I don't live in Vermont.
I can't call him. Right. That's what they like. All my New York people like, Oh, he's not doing, I even had one call. This is what kind of gave me the clue. And she's like, I came across a quote and I clicked on your link and I love your ethos and your philosophy. She's like, but since you're Vermont based, do you work in New York at all?
And I was like, um, I actually have an apartment in New York and I'm there all the time. That's where most of my work is actually. And my team is there. She's like, Oh. She's like, well, I have to, we'll have to pay for her trap. That's one of the apartment. She's like, well, I have to pay for your accommodations.
Like if you are here, I'm like, I have an apartment here. No, but so there was this misconception that I wasn't even aware of that. There was some brand confusion of like, where am I, where am I taking projects? So we're actually just sending out in our newsletter, like an FAQs of all these questions I've been getting.
I, asking clients, they're like, well, I didn't, I wasn't referring to you. Cause I thought you were so busy. I mean, I was seeing you everywhere. You were like all these books, magazines, or the other thing was like, Oh, well, you would never take my project because it's not big enough or whatever. And it's like, Oh, wow.
Interesting that that would be a perspective. Right. And so being really clear with. What you're doing, what you're taking on. So I was saying things to, to other clients that cause I'm still in their lives, right? And we've become friends. I'm like, we're so stressful. That's up to dad. I don't need it. We're doing this.
They're probably gonna refer you something at that moment. Or thank you. They need to even refer you because you're so stressed. You got so much going on. It was really a lesson in like, okay, be really clear in your messaging because I had one. Wonderful client who wanted, she's like, well, basically I think you're, you, you send out mixed messages.
And I was like, she's like, you're kind of sending out mixed messages. She's like, where do you, where do you even live really? And I was like, well, uh, and so I just realized it was like, oh, this makes total sense. Right. Cause I was wondering why do I have the most exposure that I've ever had in my phone ring in the last, the last four months?
I think it just to show you when you, when you just assume you make assumptions. That, that people get where you are and where you're working and what you're, that nothing's really changed about you. You may live somewhere and you may do this and whatever. You may be opening up your shop in Vermont and you may be living there as your home base, but it doesn't change where you service and where you like to work.
And you have your apartment in New York and that's your, that's your bread and butter. Right? Yeah. New England. It's like, I work in Connecticut. I work in upstate New York. I work in the Hamptons, you know, for like, But also that perception of just being too busy. That, that really is something that are untouchable.
That's a whole other podcast episode I feel like you and I could dive into for an hour, but I've had the same thing happen to where they look at you like, Oh my God, they were looking at that project that they just did. And I don't know if it's because I'm coming across as too boisterous. I don't know if it's because I'm coming across as too braggadocious about it, but I have asked myself many times and like, do I need to reel it in?
And, but you want to talk about your projects. Of course, you want to talk about the things that you've done. Right. And show people what you've done. But also I think there's another marketing side of it to where you always have to be marketing yourself and say, yes, we have this project, but we're still available to do other things for now.
We're working three months ahead. We're onboarding clients three months from now. So don't forget about us. We're still here. That kind of a thing. It's always, always marketing yourself. Yeah. And like, now that's kind of, I've gone back to like clients and said, because when you're new, I think everyone's so want to be engaged and really supportive and helping and referring and doing all those things.
But when they start to see it's like, wow, you probably have no time to even have lunch with me. It's kind of what they're thinking, right? It's like, cause how can you be doing all of this, being all these places is really making sure you don't lose that personal touch, even with. Past clients or referral sources or whoever, and just kind of being really clear.
It's like, yeah, it's like we're, we're, we're full at the moment, but depending on the project, if it's not starting for three months, we would totally have a conversation today. So anybody that comes your way that you would think that we would be a good fit for us, send them and we'll, we'll see if it's a good fit.
And if it works, then we'll make it work. And so just the changing of the language of the conversation around how, even if I'm talking about, it's like, Oh gosh, cause I don't, I'm not going to be inauthentic to the ones that are friends and be like. Oh my gosh. Oh, we have this, this, this, we have three installs for Christmas.
And guess what? Then the good news is we're going to have four off the decks, which means we have space for new clients. So if you hear from anybody or know of anyone, be sure to let me know. Cause I've got three spaces coming up. And you know what I decided we're going to come back and do a whole other, we're going to do the episode on the facade of the luxury interior designer.
I just decided because I feel. That there is this facade that people put us on this pedestal that is untouchable. We're busy or two, you would never work with me. Yes, yes. And I think that's something that whether people are new. Are in the middle or whether they're there, they are, they're either experiencing it or they are going to experience it at some point in their careers.
And it is a valid thing that we have to address and we have to figure out how to maneuver that. Because it is a, it's a, it's a real situation. And I think that I would love to dive into that. New York designers come in here. What's he doing? It's like, we don't know. And. He probably would never want to take on one of our projects, right?
Not even knowing that, like, that's not even how I pick projects. Right. And so, yeah, I'm, Hey, I've, it's about, it's about the project. It's about, are we a good fit and profitability? It's got to be there, but it's not about a certain spin or not asserts, but I want to have fun at this point in my career. And I want to do.
Things and work with people that I'm diving with. If you're drawn to my ethos, I love that even more because it's like, we're going to be simpatico. We're probably going to become friends. It's going to be a fun process. So it's so much more than just like, would you work with on my project? And I think that's part of the communication and setting realistic expectations and clarity of message as well.
Yeah. And guess what? There's a person behind the logo. There's a real person behind Joshua Smith design, right? There's a person behind that who is there. Who can talk to you and fill you in on all of the details of that and let you know, yes, we have room for you. And this is when it's going to happen. And yes, we want to work with you.
Right. It's like, why don't we include that in our social media messaging? Right. It's like, we talk about all that. It's like, oh my gosh, we're wrapping up this install. That's such great news. We're going to have the two spots available to work with new clients. And I just can't wait to see who the universe is going to bring into our lives next.
It's like. Very simple to do. It's very easy. Yeah. Well, I, but I didn't do that. And so, yeah, so we can talk. I was talking to a designer once, and I'm not even gonna say because you would know the person, but they were saying to me, I just don't know why no one is. They, they feel like I'm unreachable. They feel like I'm untouchable.
And, and I, and I went to this person's social media and I started scrolling and I'm like. It's them in a fur coat with glasses on is them this, and it's all these things. I'm like, Oh my God, you look untouchable. And it's like talking about all these tons of things, but never, ever were the messages directed towards the client, which is what we're saying is speak to the client, brand yourself to the client, always have that ideal client in your head.
And to me, if I always have that ideal client in my head, no matter where I'm speaking, whether it's on stage, whether it's on this podcast, whether it's in person at a meeting, wherever it's always. Coming out as if that's the person that I'm speaking to. So that ideal client I feel is going to always gravitate toward me.
But if I put up this facade of fakeness, and this is this she, she, she of design that they want us to be, then no one's going to appeal to that or the wrong people will for sure. And, and I think this is where. Consistent brand messaging is so important people at this point, no, even before they even have a conversation with me based on my website, because my brand is so clear about what I believe in, what I'm about my mission, my focus, my passion, my commitment, sustainability, wellness.
Those people that resonate with that are going to reach out to me, not even specifically because I might be the best designer, but because they want that part of it too. And so to have. People say they call me because of that part, not just because they love the rooms is like really special and meaningful.
It means I'm doing a great job with that. But it's also the same thing of like, if that, if there is this facade that you're this person and yet you're desperate for, for business and profit, it's like, well, there's going to be this stuff and a disconnect for sure. And so I think I tell people, you know, their first thing, like, if you're looking for, and I don't mean this.
I'm like, I'm not the, the bow tie and loafers designer. I'm like Josh from Texas, small country town. I'm still like, I'm about comfort. I'm about to take your shoes off if I could be barefoot all the time, I would. And so I'm just, I'm not at the stage of my life where I'm going to pretend. And what has, what, what, what the difference is, is like people actually love that more because when I first started, I was so.
Thought I had to be so polished and so perfect, but what it was, was I was dimming my light. I wasn't letting people see who I really was. They didn't know I was funny because I was so buttoned up. And then over the course of six months, you start to let your guard down. You're having more fun. You'd be more silly.
And they're like, I would have never guessed you were this fun and playful. And I'm like, really? And they're like, well, yeah, because you didn't really say much other than strictly business. And so I just, now it's just like, look, we're either going to be friends or we're not, and we're going to love working together or not.
And, and it's been such a game changer because Oprah was right. When you allow yourself to be seen, people will see you and they'll see your essence. They'll be drawn to your essence and they'll feel that and it'll feel good. And people want to be around people that make them feel good. And so it is more than just being able to execute and being creative.
I think it's also about, it's like my angel decided, right. It's like, so not what you said or what you did, but it's, how did you make people feel? That's what they remember. And that's what, why people come back. Beautifully said. Yeah. Your personal life and your business life are intertwined. Completely, I feel, and they always find a way to one, help the other one out.
And when you are your true, authentic self with your business, your business will grow and flourish and you, and the right people are attracted to that. So, oh my gosh, I could talk forever to you. This has been so great, Josh. Part two, part two. Yes. By the way, your website is beautiful. We didn't even get into all the wellness as much as I wanted to, but it's okay.
We can talk about that at a different time because I think this was a much more important message right now in where we are in the world and where everyone is in 2024. And I feel like I got a lot off of my chest and I think you probably did too. So this is good. Cathartic. Maury, you talk about it. It's like we were talking external processing and it's like sharing this information because As I've talked to other designers recently who kind of have been open sharing some of their struggles.
I was like, you too, like, I'm not the only one. Like I thought it was just me. And there's something about knowing that, like, I'm not the only one and that you had to work through challenging things. And you're telling is now it's like, oh, well, if you get a situation with this, call me, you have to support as another designer who knows exactly what fight to go through this.
It's like, you don't have to navigate these choppy waters alone when they have, when these, when these thunderstorms roll in. So, uh, I love it. I did a recap of my 2023 on a previous episode where I was like, you know what? I'm going to tell everybody exactly what happened to me in 2023. And here you go.
Because I feel like it is important to share. So thank you for sharing. Thank you for having all this wonderful information for everyone. Tell everybody how to find you again. The website's beautiful. The social media, all the places where you hang out. Okay. So my social media handle is the same everywhere and it's at Joshua Smith Inc.
I N C so it's Joshua Smith Inc. And my website is joshuasmithinc. com and I'm on Instagram, Pinterest, Facebook. All the places. And I also, if you're more interested in curious about the blissful living and wellness and sustainability and lifestyle stuff, I do twice a month newsletter blog called blissful living.
And you can sign up on my website to get that. And that comes out twice a month. And then there's also a free. Downloadable like 20 page PDF of kind of like ways to create sacred space in your home. And it's a very simple how to almost like even going through the beginning of the design process all the way the other way and just incorporate living in your daily life, like a brief overview, but it helps you get clear about, because I feel like it all starts with me, the design process with like capturing the essence of who you are.
And I find oftentimes many people don't really fully know. What they love and what brings them joy and what brings them bliss. And so you have to start there. And so this kind of is a worksheet of how to get there first before you then start coming up with your concept and inspiration for your space.
So that's yeah, that'll come to you for free. If you sign up for the newsletter and we can communicate there, I'm all about building community. That's where I feel like I'm most called today is to build connection and community around like minded souls, wanting to live better and do better in the world.
We will put all the links to your locations in the show notes. And thank you for sharing your story. Thank you for sharing your heart, your ups and downs. And thank you for just being authentically you. You're, you're fabulous. We, I love having you on. Thank you so much. And we'll be back for part two soon.
And are you, are you at market this weekend in Vegas? I am. Yep. Okay. I'm going to be there. So I may have to look you up. Okay. Perfect. I'll see you there then. All right. Okay. Thanks Josh. Thanks for sticking with me to the end of the designer within podcast. It means the world to me. If you're ready to dive deeper into the topics that we've discussed here, be sure to check out my online coaching and courses program, design success academy.
com. Here I will teach you everything you need to know to run your interior design business. From starting the project all the way to the end, including marketing and pricing your services for profit. And for more information on this podcast, including how to be a guest or my design services in general, go to johnmcclain.
co. That's johnmcclain. co. See you soon, friend.